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Thread: Rambling and Gambling

  1. #3061
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    I've noticed that William Hills have started going up really early with the next days prices. They started putting tomorrows in about 2.45 time. Apparently they put the prices in for todays races around 1-00 yesterday lunchtime.

  2. #3062
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quixall Crossett View Post
    I've noticed that William Hills have started going up really early with the next days prices. They started putting tomorrows in about 2.45 time. Apparently they put the prices in for todays races around 1-00 yesterday lunchtime.

    Are they betting to a huge overround that early tho? any idea what type of bet they will take at those prices?

  3. #3063
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jombo View Post
    Are they betting to a huge overround that early tho? any idea what type of bet they will take at those prices?
    Just looked there overrounds are ok. I suppose it would be the quickest way to get accounts closed. i presume its only online and not in there shops.
    Last edited by Jombo; 24-06-2019 at 15:47.

  4. #3064
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jombo View Post
    Are they betting to a huge overround that early tho? any idea what type of bet they will take at those prices?
    To be fair mate, they are betting to what i would class as a normal percentage when opening up on the overnight market. They were betting around 2%/2.5% per runner on the two races at Beverley that i looked at. There will be far worse than that around when every other "bookie" has copied, adjusted slightly and then pasted their prices. For some of the burglars that masquerade as bookies, between 3.5% and 4% per runner is their norm.
    As the saying goes, at least Dick Turpin wore a mask !!!
    Last edited by Quixall Crossett; 24-06-2019 at 16:48.

  5. #3065
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jombo View Post
    Are they betting to a huge overround that early tho? any idea what type of bet they will take at those prices?
    Dunno what sort of bets they are taking but i think they need to get a decent compiler or go careful with their percentage. That said, if they go too big there will be no point in putting them up so early.
    They got caught with Celestial Force at Beverley this afternoon. They actually put it in at an opening show of 14/1 ! They quickly went 10's as i was pushing the good lady to get on. By the time she was ready to back it, it was down to 8's. When she tried to get a second bet on to double it with another, it was down to 13/2. The silly sod didnt bother but then actually backed it later at 11/2 with another firm.

    They opened up at 11.15 this morning on some races. I'm just wondering how long this will last.

  6. #3066
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    I’m just wondering is it worth all the hassle of trying to get on with them.

  7. #3067
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jombo View Post
    I’m just wondering is it worth all the hassle of trying to get on with them.
    The answer is a definite no !!! I cant get on with them and there will be many more like me. And those people lucky enough to get the 14's and 10's wont be around much longer either.

  8. #3068
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    That’s the problem now obviously it would be worth the hassle if you could back 3/1 shots @14s but it’s no point if they won’t leave you on. There is no point to these early prices as it’s hugely problematic to get on. I am amazed nobookie has said they will lay horses to a certain amount at quoted prices. I have a feeling a lot of these early price merchants hav3 a maximum liability limit of a couple of hundred. Anyway that’s the way it is now so I suppose no point crying over it now!

  9. #3069
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jombo View Post
    That’s the problem now obviously it would be worth the hassle if you could back 3/1 shots @14s but it’s no point if they won’t leave you on. There is no point to these early prices as it’s hugely problematic to get on. I am amazed nobookie has said they will lay horses to a certain amount at quoted prices. I have a feeling a lot of these early price merchants hav3 a maximum liability limit of a couple of hundred. Anyway that’s the way it is now so I suppose no point crying over it now!
    I actually hope, from a purely selfish point of view, that they pack this in soon. By going in so early they are tipping off the rest as to what is too big. I much prefer that they all go in around teatime so i can get bits on with a few of them before the price is cut.

  10. #3070
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    Things arent going to change though mate. You and I both know that. And as i said a couple of months ago, i'm not wasting my time any more whinging about them. I have been saying for a long time now that here in Britain we have the lowest standard of government, politician, MP's, that i have ever known. That also applies to bookmakers and traders. The worst and most shambolic ever !

    Rant over.
    I'm on to Thursdays cards already

  11. #3071
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    Back to racing and a theme that i know a few of you on here like.
    James Black brought Impressive Duke over here last week and the horse scooted up in a chase at Stratford. Prior to that run, the horse had shown very little and its best run had probably been when he was second in a maiden point at Loughbrickland. When he won at Stratford, he did so off a mark of 89. He stayed over and three days later won another chase, this time at Market Rasen off a mark of 96. The horse obviously takes its racing well and its possible that a repeat performance could be on the cards this weekend. Black has got him entered in five races, three at Cartmel and two at Uttoxeter. Whats more interesting is that four of those races are over hurdles and two of them are on Friday where the horse is able to run off a mark of 89. Because the revised handicap marks dont kick in until Saturday, the horse will have to run off its revised mark of 104 in its chosen race on Sunday. So its a fair bet that Impressive Duke will be lining up in the Lake District on Friday.

    I'm looking forward to seeing what he does.

  12. #3072
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    talking of horse that have shown very little, there's been a few of these win recently, Irish Trainer brought over The Jam Man to Southwell, it was backed in from 20/1 into 11/4.

    Trainer said it improved suddenly over a few days and they decided to bring it over run at Southwell.

    I have no knowledge of the trainer but I've got to say I didn't like the cut of his jib if you know what I mean

  13. #3073
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    Quote Originally Posted by typhoon View Post
    talking of horse that have shown very little, there's been a few of these win recently, Irish Trainer brought over The Jam Man to Southwell, it was backed in from 20/1 into 11/4.

    Trainer said it improved suddenly over a few days and they decided to bring it over run at Southwell.

    I have no knowledge of the trainer but I've got to say I didn't like the cut of his jib if you know what I mean
    to be fair the Jam man had the form - it should never have being 20/1.

  14. #3074
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    Quote Originally Posted by typhoon View Post
    talking of horse that have shown very little, there's been a few of these win recently, Irish Trainer brought over The Jam Man to Southwell, it was backed in from 20/1 into 11/4.

    Trainer said it improved suddenly over a few days and they decided to bring it over run at Southwell.

    I have no knowledge of the trainer but I've got to say I didn't like the cut of his jib if you know what I mean
    Thanks for that typhoon, my old mate. You know this is gonna be a long drawn out reply. There are so many points to address here.

    First of all, the trainer said that the horse had come back into form in the last two weeks. That might well be the case but it doesnt leave a nice taste in the mouth of all the punters who backed something else in the race. They have probably looked at his last couple of runs where he has been tailed both times and quickly discarded him. That said, this is not the first time that this horse has suddenly found some form. When he was with his previous trainer, the horse hardly beat another horse home in his first seven starts under rules before winning three times in the space of six days last spring and being well backed every time. It then switched to McNally but they done their money first time up when it was just touched off at Perth on its first start for them before getting it all back next time out at Hexham. It then had a break before coming back with a run to blow the cobwebs away before getting well backed again at Southwell and scooting up. It was there for everyone to see and its always in the back of my mind when i do my studying.

    The stewards "noted" his explanation after the race that the horse had come back into form. I bet all the trainers in the land were laughing their socks off when they heard that. Get hauled in after landing a gamble and just say to the stewards, "He's come back to form at home". Job done and now i'm going home to count all the money.

    I could get started on the stewards and the BHA but i'm not going down that route any more. You all know my thoughts.

    All the owners in the land say that they leave things to the trainer because the trainers know more than them. But i would like to blow my own trumpet here and say that i know one fact that some trainers dont know. You hear that some trainers have said after their horse has won that it has improved for the sun on its back. Other say that it has improved for the change of scenery. I have heard some say that they have changed its bedding and its breathing has improved and thats why it won. And others say that they have changed its routine and also now leave it in the field during the day instead of locking it up in the stable. But the one fact that proves correct nearly every time, and is probably/certainly nearer the truth than all the previous excuses is the one fact that i have yet to hear. I'm just waiting for the day when a trainer goes into the stewards room and says, "We let the handbrake off today and we've had fortunes on it" !!!!
    Thats how horses improve. Forget a change of feed or routine or whatever ! Just get the WD40 out and gather as much cash as you can lay your hands on and the horse will improve a stone or two !!

    I cant finish this bit without one dig at the stewards and therefore at the BHA who, lets face it, employ these utter morons. In their report, the Southwell stewards said that The Jam Man "appeared" to show improved form compared to its run at Downpatrick where it was beaten 98L !!!!!
    Where the f*** does the "appeared" come into it ????? The top weight at Downpatrick was rated 114. In the Southwell race there were two horses rated 119, one rated 121 and another who ran off 122. Even if you take into consideration the difference in British/Irish ratings, its fair to say that the Southwell race was a better one. Yet it has gone from being beaten 98L on June 15th to sluicing up, eased down and well backed on June 24th ! And the f****** stewards reckoned that it "appeared" to show improved form !?!?!?

    One more bit to add regarding the stewards. McNally was called in before the stewards before the race and asked about his plans etc. Charles Byrnes has been called in a few times and quizzed and there have been one or two others as well. It does seem as though there is a bit of a vendetta against some Irish trainers going on. They would obviously deny it of course but that wouldnt wash with me. I'm tempted to get in touch with them and give them a list of some English trainers they might want to have a word with before the horses run. Just off the top of my head, even while i'm typing this i can think of seven or eight and then if they want me to send them a list of the little cartel/club of jockeys who dont play the game then i am more than willing.

    And theres not a bookie in the land who can moan about getting caught with this one. Just look at the facts. An Irish horse comes over for a race at Southwell. It has shown absolutely nothing in its last two starts. Last year it had shown nothing in seven starts and then came over to Britain and went on to win three races in six days, all well backed.
    And now its come over to Britain again.............
    A decent trader worth his salt, (Are there any around any more ? I very much doubt it !!! ), would have this one marked down as "careful" and would keep it under just in case. There would be no heroics or Billy Bigbollocks here. I would be ducking it. But because there are no traders any more and all the firms rely on automated systems and bots, they all just copy each other and all the prices follow each other automatically. And thats why they dont have odds compilers any more (thankfully ). Can you imagine being a compiler who has done his studying and homework and put a horse in at 6/1 and then left work and gone home. He then checks in to Oddschecker later that night to see how things are going and finds that his 6/1 chance is now 16's !!! And thats because all the other firms bots have pushed their price out.
    Hands up how many firms wanted to be 20's about The Jam Man the other day !?!?

    I thought as much !!!

    Once again, thanks typhoon

  15. #3075
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    QC - I am not sure would you say that was a better race than the downpatrick race. The irish handicappers must be about 10 pound or so better in i would reckon. I see the jam man is entered at Cartmel on Sunday.

  16. #3076
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jombo View Post
    QC - I am not sure would you say that was a better race than the downpatrick race. The irish handicappers must be about 10 pound or so better in i would reckon. I see the jam man is entered at Cartmel on Sunday.
    To be fair mate, theres not a great deal between the races. But there is a great deal in the way it ran. As you know, the point i was making was that in one of the races it has been totally tailed and beaten 98L, and in the other, and lets call it a similar race, it has scooted in, eased right down, and well backed in the process.

    And the stewards seem to think that there "appeared" to be an improvement.

  17. #3077
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    The Jam Man is actually entered for two races on Sunday. He's in both a hurdle and a chase.

  18. #3078
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    can't really understand why the stewards are interviewing trainers before and after the race. Fair enough after the race but what do they expect to hear before the race from the trainer? Was that trainer mcnally warned off before? or did he have something to do with Anseanachai ciste?

  19. #3079
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jombo View Post
    can't really understand why the stewards are interviewing trainers before and after the race. Fair enough after the race but what do they expect to hear before the race from the trainer? Was that trainer mcnally warned off before? or did he have something to do with Anseanachai ciste?
    I think its a case of the stewards saying, "We are watching you".

  20. #3080
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    We are watching you and can you give us a tip ?
    Or
    We are watching you and will do absolutely nothing if we find out you're as crooked as a dog's hind leg
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